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Podcast


COMING SOON: BUY THE PEOPLE, A BANKSHOT SEASON ON POPULISM IN FINANCE

March 21, 2024 10:58 AM
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Transcription:


Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and
human transcribers, and may contain errors. Please check the corresponding audio
for the authoritative record.



Chana Schoenberger (00:06):
I'm Chana Schoenberger. I'm the editor in chief of American Banker and I have
with me here are Washington Bureau Chief John Heltman to talk about the new
season of Bankshot. Hi John.

John Heltman (00:17):
Hey Chana, how are you?

Chana Schoenberger (00:18):
Good, good, good. So this is all about economic populism and banks. Why are we
looking at economic populism right now?

John Heltman (00:26):
That is a great question. So the title for season six is Buy the People, BUY,
like to Purchase the People, a very delicious pun. And the conceit behind all of
this is an exploration of how populism informs financial regulation writ large.
And it's a very good topic because populism in some way or another does actually
inform a lot of the impetus behind financial regulation. A lot of the calculus
of how various aspects of monetary policy operates. Even the formation of whole
agencies in the case of the CFPB is really informed by this idea that the
financial system is a kind of just use the parlance of how populism works. It's
kind of like the people versus an elite. The entire financial system in some
ways is an elite, right? It is a sort of select who make important decisions
about important things in everybody's lives.

(01:29)

And especially after 2008, there was a very visceral feeling that kind of trust
that had been placed in this industry to make good decisions for the consumer,
for the average American, and really globally the average person that they had
abused that trust. And the response to that, the policy response to that in the
form of the Basel three accords, Dodd-Frank, and of course elsewhere around the
world, but we're American bankers. So we're talking about America here. A lot of
that is informed by this kind of populism. And what has emerged over the last
couple of years is that regulatory sort of response to this very significant
crisis has been mostly kind left-leaning in its solutions and its kind of
trappings. But more recently there's been a kind of right wing populism that in
many cases kind of diagnoses the same kind of problems. It identifies the same
issues, but forwards something closer to an opposite policy response to those
issues. So framing it more like if democratic populism is the sort of financial
system is the elite and the people need to hold the financial system accountable
by way of government, the sort of right wing version is like the regulatory
apparatus is the elite, and we need to hold them accountable to how they treat
financial companies that in turn interact with us. So it is a slightly different
framing, but how this plays out in the future, I think we'll have very, very
interesting consequences.

Chana Schoenberger (03:06):
It's interesting too because when you talk to, especially community bankers and
a lot of regional bankers will consider themselves to be community bankers with
a really big institution. They think of themselves as the people. They consider
that they have a very strong connection to the community, that they're very
integrated into the community, that they really know the people or their
frontline bankers really know the people they're lending to. They think this is
a real advantage of their business model, but also they sort of think of
themselves as being different from those big banks in coastal cities. So it's
sort of almost, who do you consider the elite? Because one would say that a
banker in a community is a member of the elite locally.

John Heltman (03:49):
Yeah. And I mean this is something that bankers are kind of in the middle in a
lot of ways because of course, if you're one of the mega banks, your
interactions will mostly be with supervisors, policymakers, lawmakers, very few
are going to branches and hanging out with people and overseeing loans. Smaller
bankers interface with people all the time and probably rightly feel like they
have a pretty good sense of what community needs are. Ordinary people, on the
other hand, don't interact with bankers all that much and don't really think
about them all that much. And so except in a sort of abstract and kind of
monolithic sense, like Wall Street is kind of a catchall for finance in a way
that I think doesn't really do justice to the different categories of bank or
the different bank conflicts that are quite significant indeed. But what's
interesting again about this series is that every beat on our bureau has
something to say about populism and has to say about how these institutions be
it Congress, the Federal Reserve, the CFPB and other bank regulators. A lot of
what the obstacles that they're trying to negotiate are between protecting
people on the one hand, not pointlessly hurting banks on the other, staying
within the confines of the law, which again is dictated by Congress, which is
responsible to people. So it is kind of like a triangulating exactly how to
navigate some of these issues is interesting. It is also changing as people's
attitudes change.

Chana Schoenberger (05:27):
Interesting. Okay. So each of your four Washington reporters did an episode for
this series. What are the episodes about?

John Heltman (05:34):
Alright, so the first episode is from Claire Williams, our congress reporter,
and she is looking at populism as a sort of political movement and how it has
evolved from 2008 Elizabeth Warren, her kind of political rise more or less
coincides with the financial crisis making her debut on the Daily Show back in,
what was it, 2010 or 2009, her kind of white paper putting out the idea of the
ccf. PB was the onus of the beginning of the CFPB as it exists today. And that
brand, she's not the only one with that kind of brand and what she focuses on,
or she examines the reelection campaign for shared Brown senate banking
committee chair, she brown running for reelection in Ohio, an increasingly red
state whose other senator JD Vance is a good example of this kind of more right
wing iteration of populism. So this is a Greek microcosm of this kind of
populism on populism struggle.

(06:37)

And whether she brown, again, a sort of progressive member of the Senate can
prevail in a otherwise increasingly Republican dominated state is a very
interesting race to watch. Kyle Campbell, our fed reporter, examines monetary
policy and how populism has informed the Federal Reserve's response to the
financial crisis. But also more recently, this uptick in inflation and its
efforts to make itself understood by people who have historically not really
taken the time to understand the Fed, except as a sort of high tower black box
of numbers go up and down. And that is a really centuries old struggle between
people and the central bank in the United States is a very fraught history. And
he talks to some really outstanding voices and thinkers in that space. Abra, our
F-D-I-C-O-C-C reporters writing about Basel and how the sort of struggle about
what is the appropriate level of bank capital is a sort of secular question that
reasonable people can disagree about, but has become increasingly political and
increasingly populist in its politics since the introduction of the Basel three
endgame proposal last July.

(07:59)

Again, very, very interesting meditation on the issue of bank capital, how much
capital bank should retain, but also how and whether this can be made into a
sort of kitchen table issue. And then Kate Barry, our CFPB reporter, is looking
at the CFPB, which is an interesting sort of modern iteration of taking populism
as a concept and turning it into an actual federal agency. And that's something
that has been tried before several times. They always end up getting eroded a
little bit over time, like the FTC started off more strident and then got a
little bit more captured really over time. And so whether CAPB can buck that
trend.

Chana Schoenberger (08:41):

Interesting. Yeah, it's going to be a great series. Wonderful. So be sure to
listen to this limited season of Bankshot, which is dropping in late March,
2024. If you want to hear more news and analysis of the banking world, go to
americanbanker.com/subscribe From American Banker, I'm Chana Schoenberger, and
thanks for listening.



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