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    <h2 class="block-header">
      <i class="fa--xf fas fa-chart-bar" aria-hidden="true"></i> If I say "Object B is three times larger than Object A", this means....
    </h2>
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        <li>
          <div class="">
            <div class="pollResult   ">
              <h3 class="pollResult-response">Object B is TRIPLE the size of Object A</h3>
              <span class="pollResult-votes">
                <span class="u-muted">Votes:</span> 1,051 </span>
              <span class="pollResult-percentage"> 92.8% </span>
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        <li>
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              <h3 class="pollResult-response">Object B is QUADRUPLE the size of Object A</h3>
              <span class="pollResult-votes">
                <span class="u-muted">Votes:</span> 82 </span>
              <span class="pollResult-percentage"> 7.2% </span>
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          <li>
            <dl class="pairs pairs--inline">
              <dt>Total voters</dt>
              <dd>1,133</dd>
            </dl>
          </li>
          <li>This poll will close: <time class="u-dt" dir="auto" datetime="2023-05-28T21:40:26-0400" data-time="1685324426" data-date-string="May 28, 2023" data-time-string="9:40 PM" title="May 28, 2023 at 9:40 PM">May 28, 2023 at 9:40 PM</time>.
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WHAT DOES "THREE TIMES LARGER THAN" MEAN TO YOU? (POLL INSIDE)

 * Thread starter Cels
 * Start date Yesterday at 9:40 PM


 * Discussion
 * EtcetEra Forum


IF I SAY "OBJECT B IS THREE TIMES LARGER THAN OBJECT A", THIS MEANS....


 * OBJECT B IS TRIPLE THE SIZE OF OBJECT A
   
   Votes: 1,051 92.8%


 * OBJECT B IS QUADRUPLE THE SIZE OF OBJECT A
   
   Votes: 82 7.2%

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 * Total voters 1,133
 * This poll will close: May 28, 2023 at 9:40 PM.

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Answer New


THE-PI-GUY

Member
Oct 29, 2017 5,208

 * Yesterday at 10:48 PM

 * 
 * #51

I'm going to go with 4x.

"Object A is 3x as large as Object B." = 3x
"Object A is 3x larger than Object B" = 4x.

Large is a general descriptor of volume.

Larger is a comparison of volume, so it's the difference. The difference between
object B and A is 3 of object B.
 




SHEEPINATOR

Member
Jul 25, 2018 24,216

 * Yesterday at 10:49 PM

 * 
 * #52

It's terribly worded, but one way of looking at it is:

0 times larger = same size
Therefore...
1 times larger = double
2 times larger = triple
3 times larger = quadruple
 



CONFUSINGJAZZ

NOT THE RON PAUL TEXAS FAN.

Member
Oct 26, 2017 2,983 China

 * Yesterday at 10:52 PM

 * 
 * #53

This is some Terrence Howard bullshit.

If you have ever in your life ever heard someone say "1 times larger," I might
see your point, but as it is

1 x 1 = 1, Terrence.
 



JEDI2016

Member
Oct 27, 2017 12,795

 * Yesterday at 10:56 PM

 * 
 * #54

1x = 100%

So 3x = 300%
 



RA

RAP GENIUS

Moderator
Oct 27, 2017 11,315 Dark Space

 * Yesterday at 10:57 PM

 * 
 * #55

3x = 200%, there's no reason to get more complicated than that for me, in a
conversation about how the majority of the population would relate to the
question.
 



STABI

Member
Oct 25, 2017 1,169 France / san francisco

 * Yesterday at 10:57 PM

 * 
 * #56

You have to separate.
It 3 times...... Larger

The 3 times tell you to multiply by 3 and larger tell you it's about it's size.

For real though, this is a question you ask yourself when you're 10 and then you
figure out how it's used in everyday life and that makes it the true answer.

No actually blabla. No fun allowed.
 



RASU

Member
Dec 22, 2017 553

 * Yesterday at 10:59 PM

 * 
 * #57

i went with 3x, but now i am seeing the logic behind 4x. this new knowledge
sucks, however, because i will always double guess what the speaker’s intent is
when they say “x times larger than,” as it is clear the layman thinks it means
3x, as i used to!
 



LORD ERROR

Member
Oct 27, 2017 3,888

 * Yesterday at 11:06 PM

 * 
 * #58

> bwahhhhh said:
> Take your first sentence, change "three times" to "300%" in your first
> sentence, do you still think the same
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

"Increase by 300%" is not the same thing as "3x".
100+300% = 400
3x100 = 300
 



MCSCROGGZ

The Fallen
Jan 11, 2018 5,841

 * Yesterday at 11:08 PM

 * 
 * #59

You know how when you are told there is going to be a twist ending in a movie,
how you actively watch the movie differently and the twist ending can be a lot
easier to parse? I feel like these sorts of questions are like that. Practically
nobody would hear or read the sentence in the OP and think it’s anything other
than 3x the size, yet because of the specifics of the wording it’s technically
incorrect; however, I think it’s clear what the intent is when it’s said that
way and I believe the overwhelming majority of people wouldn’t even think twice
about it.
 



BWAHHHHH

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017 2,769

 * Yesterday at 11:12 PM

 * 
 * #60

"X Corp. stock rose by 300% over the last decade" is something I hear all the
time in finance and it means it's 400% of the original value and i hate it.
that's maybe a more common example.

just say 400% of its original value, let the numbers speak for themselves rather
than me closely check if you wrote "by" or "to"


> Lord Error said:
> "Increase by 300%" is not the same thing as "3x".
> 100+300% = 400
> 3x100 = 300
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


"Three dollar bill is 300% larger value than one dollar." edit: nevermind, your
example is not the same wording as op because you added "value"
 
Last edited: Yesterday at 11:17 PM



L THAMMY

SPACENOID

Member
Oct 25, 2017 45,003

 * Yesterday at 11:17 PM

 * 
 * #61

Means it was painted red nm
 



HILARIOUS_BEARIOUS

Member
Nov 4, 2017 6,474

 * Yesterday at 11:18 PM

 * 
 * #62

This comes up a lot in my job, particularly when talking about probability. We
often have to explain to leadership and comms people the difference between
something being "as likely" vs "more likely".

On a somewhat related note, I cannot stand how Americans will say stuff like
"three ecks improvement" or "five ecks optical zoom". It sounds like they've
never encountered maths before and are just reading something they don't
understand.
 



LORD ERROR

Member
Oct 27, 2017 3,888

 * Yesterday at 11:20 PM

 * 
 * #63

> bwahhhhh said:
> "Three dollar bill is 300% larger value than one dollar." edit: nevermind,
> your example is not the same wording as op because you added "value"
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

Yeah I guess percents can add an extra layer of confusion to this, but as per
OP's question "three times larger" neatly translates into "3*Something"
mathematically, so it shouldn't be overcomplicated.
 


OP
OP

CELS

Member
Oct 26, 2017 6,423

 * Yesterday at 11:32 PM

 * 
 * #64

> bwahhhhh said:
> "X Corp. stock rose by 300% over the last decade" is something I hear all the
> time in finance and it means it's 400% of the original value and i hate it.
> that's maybe a more common example.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

That situation is similar to that of the poll, although I also see it used
incorrectly. As in, if the stock price is $50 a share, and is now $100 a share,
someone might say (wrongly) that the price increased 200%. This is wrong,
because the increase was 100%, not 200%.


> Lord Error said:
> "three times larger" neatly translates into "3*Something" mathematically
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

It doesn't, and that's the why the phrase should be avoided entirely. People
will shortcut "three times" to mean "3x" as much of the poll answerers did,
omitting the "larger" from the phrase entirely. "Four times as large" is
completely unambiguous which is why that is much preferred over "three times
larger" even though both phrases mean the same thing.
 
Last edited: Yesterday at 11:39 PM



KINTHEY

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017 19,436

 * Yesterday at 11:39 PM

 * 
 * #65

> Cels said:
> Spoiler: NYT Manual of Style
> 
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

They forgot the part where everything needs to be compared to the size of a
football field
 



SACRILICIOUS

Member
Oct 30, 2017 2,481

 * Today at 12:09 AM

 * 
 * #66

Definitely triple.

I guess I kinda see where the quadruple comes in. But as someone who works in a
heavily mathematical field, "three times larger" is just multiplicative and not
some multi term equation (there is literally a "times" in there, c'mon).

It sure as hell isn't "300% greater", which is abomination that should burn in
hell alongside "Xth century".
 



SIGN MY GUESTBOOK!

Member
May 26, 2018 21,022

 * Today at 12:12 AM

 * 
 * #67

> Havok said:
> Nobody has ever said 1 times larger
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


Right. They say twice as big or 100% larger.
 


OP
OP

CELS

Member
Oct 26, 2017 6,423

 * Today at 12:33 AM

 * 
 * #68

> Sacrilicious said:
> Definitely triple.
> 
> I guess I kinda see where the quadruple comes in. But as someone who works in
> a heavily mathematical field, "three times larger" is just multiplicative and
> not some multi term equation (there is literally a "times" in there, c'mon).
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

The tricky part is that even though "times" is in there, it's additive. Add 3x
to the original -- it's larger by that many times. X + 3X = 4X.

for example, if something is "50% larger" it's not half the size, it's 1.5x the
size, or, if you prefer, X + 0.5X = 1.5X.
 



SACRILICIOUS

Member
Oct 30, 2017 2,481

 * Today at 12:40 AM

 * 
 * #69

> Cels said:
> The tricky part is that even though "times" is in there, it's additive. Add 3x
> to the original -- it's larger by that many times. X + 3X = 4X.
> 
> for example, if something is "50% larger" it's not half the size, it's 1.5x
> the size, or, if you prefer, X + 0.5X = 1.5X.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


The thing is, people don't say "A times larger" to mean "x+Ax". Nobody thinks
twice as large means triple.

It kinda works, but also isn't common and adds mathematical confusion for no
reason. I guess gets too into numbering debates to address, but I feel this is
an easier one.
 



NDED

Member
Nov 14, 2017 9,447

 * Today at 12:41 AM

 * 
 * #70

People aren't that tricky. They don't use the word "three" to describe how much
larger something is than a other thing they when the larger thing is actually
equivalent in size to four of the smaller thing.
 


OP
OP

CELS

Member
Oct 26, 2017 6,423

 * Today at 12:43 AM

 * 
 * #71

> Sacrilicious said:
> The thing is, people don't say "A times larger" to mean "x+Ax". Nobody thinks
> twice as large means triple.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


"Twice as large" is not triple; it's double.

"Two times larger" is triple. But as I (and the NYT Style Manual) advocate, you
should just say "three times as large" instead.
 



SACRILICIOUS

Member
Oct 30, 2017 2,481

 * Today at 1:02 AM

 * 
 * #72

> Cels said:
> "Twice as large" is not triple; it's double.
> 
> "Two times larger" is triple. But as I (and the NYT Style Manual) advocate,
> you should just say "three times as large" instead.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


I can see the distinction, but it's not how I'd read it.

I'd be surprised if most English speakers would read those as differing
statements, but they could be.

I think they probably shouldn't be, and that's how it's usually seen, so I think
it's best to go with popular consensus on this one. "The number is actually one
more" is a pretty bad numbering system.
 



CHAINSHADA

Member
Oct 25, 2017 2,278

 * Today at 1:03 AM

 * 
 * #73

Quadruple would be technically correct, but I don't think I've ever said
something is 3 times larger, 3 times as large removes the ambiguity, and if it's
something that's actually important, just do the math for them.
 



CONFUSINGJAZZ

NOT THE RON PAUL TEXAS FAN.

Member
Oct 26, 2017 2,983 China

 * Today at 1:04 AM

 * 
 * #74

> Cels said:
> "Twice as large" is not triple; it's double.
> 
> "Two times larger" is triple. But as I (and the NYT Style Manual) advocate,
> you should just say "three times as large" instead.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


No one says "One time bigger"
 



NOQUARTER

Member
Oct 25, 2017 1,351

 * Today at 1:06 AM

 * 
 * #75

I know it is supposed to be B, that it is larger than by a magnitude of three
times (so Object A + 3(Object A) ), but I've seen it used so many times to be
3xA that I now just default that to being what someone means.
 



WEEKEV

IS THIS A TEST?

Member
Oct 25, 2017 5,971

 * Today at 1:12 AM

 * 
 * #76

> bulletbill10 said:
> 1x larger would be double, so 3x larger is quadruple.
> 
> It gets complicated because 3x as large would be triple sized.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

But 1x larger isn't something people say. Twice the size = double.
 



FTF

Member
Oct 28, 2017 24,175 New York

 * Today at 1:22 AM

 * 
 * #77

3x1 is 3. Not 4. Now you make a poll asking what does 300% larger mean and
you’re getting a lot of incorrect responses lol.
 



KASWA101

Member
Oct 28, 2017 16,634

 * Today at 1:22 AM

 * 
 * #78

3x larger = 4x as large = quadruple the size
3x as large = triple the size

Quadruple is definitely correct from a technical perspective, but most people
misuse the phrase “X times larger” lol — which is fair enough because it really
should be avoided.

“as large as” is the way to go.
 



THEREAREFOURNAAN

Member
Nov 8, 2017 11,498

 * Today at 1:29 AM

 * 
 * #79

Once as large definitely means double, every human on earth says this very
commonly used phrase 500 times a day.
 


OP
OP

CELS

Member
Oct 26, 2017 6,423

 * Today at 1:33 AM

 * 
 * #80

> Sacrilicious said:
> I can see the distinction, but it's not how I'd read it.
> 
> I'd be surprised if most English speakers would read those as differing
> statements, but they could be.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


They are different if you're a careful reader -- and therein lies the problem.
To one set of readers, the two phrases may mean the same thing. To the more
precise readers, the two phrases are distinct. As an author, that's something
you can't have at all. So, the best solution is to express yourself a different
way.

I don't think this phrase is ever going to change meanings (unlike words like
decimate or replica which have changed in meaning over time) but rather they may
die out from avoidance.

Bonus page from NYT Style Manual:



 



CONFUSINGJAZZ

NOT THE RON PAUL TEXAS FAN.

Member
Oct 26, 2017 2,983 China

 * Today at 1:34 AM

 * 
 * #81

> ThereAreFourNaan said:
> Once as large definitely means double, every human on earth says this very
> commonly used phrase 500 times a day.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


29,000 results for "one time larger" on google, the only people who say it are
referring to this stupid question that no one asked.

And Terrence Howard.
 



CONFUSINGJAZZ

NOT THE RON PAUL TEXAS FAN.

Member
Oct 26, 2017 2,983 China

 * Today at 1:35 AM

 * 
 * #82

> Cels said:
> They are different, without a doubt -- and therein lies the problem. To one
> set of readers, the two phrases may mean the same thing. To the more precise
> readers, the two phrases are distinct. As an author, that's something you
> can't have at all. So, the only solution is to express yourself a different
> way.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


Ah yes, the mythical "precise" readers that don't exist.

Well, I guess this guy:



 



SPH3RE

ONE WINGED SLAYER

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017 7,690

 * Today at 1:35 AM

 * 
 * #83

None of you maniacs have ever heard someone say "wow that thing is one times
larger than the typical thing"

3x larger = 200% larger

What the fuck are we even doing here
 



BRIGHTLIGHTLAVA

Member
Oct 25, 2017 6,093

 * Today at 1:42 AM

 * 
 * #84

I’m glad the poll is correct, because so many of you are just outing yourselves
as aliens in the thread.
 



HYLIANSEVEN

COMMUNITY RESETTER - ONE WINGED SLAYER

Member
Oct 25, 2017 16,820

 * Today at 1:42 AM

 * 
 * #85

3 * 1 = 3

The answer is 3 and it's simple as that, anything else (and I am including the
New York style guide in the OP) is nonsense.
 



ROCKIN' RANGER

Member
Oct 25, 2017 1,493

 * Today at 1:54 AM

 * 
 * #86

> pikachief said:
> 300% larger, so triple the size
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...


So if I told you something had grown 50% larger would you think it was now half
of its original size?
 



CARBON

DEPLOYING THE STEALTH CRUISE MISSILE

Member
Oct 27, 2017 8,347

 * Today at 2:04 AM

 * 
 * #87

> Rockin' Ranger said:
> So if I told you something had grown 50% larger would you think it was now
> half of its original size?
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

"Our sales increased by 100%!

Crap, we didn't grow at all!"
 



AARGLEFARG

Member
Oct 27, 2017 3,685

 * Today at 2:05 AM

 * 
 * #88

Knowing how language is used, they mean three times the size.

It wouldn't cause actual confusion in real life.
 



TBRO777

Member
Nov 24, 2017 516

 * Today at 2:09 AM

 * 
 * #89

> bulletbill10 said:
> 1x larger would be double, so 3x larger is quadruple.
> 
> It gets complicated because 3x as large would be triple sized.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

no 1 time as large would be the same size, if you had a wall 5 feet tall, 1
times as large would be 5*1=5. Now if you said increase it 100% in size, then
yeah that would be double.

Edit: nevermind you are right, I misread read larger to be as large.
 
Last edited: Today at 2:15 AM



I AM A BIRD

Member
Oct 31, 2017 6,233

 * Today at 2:21 AM

 * 
 * #90

It's literally in the name. Three times larger would is saying multiplied times
3.

It's essentially saying: Size = (Value) X 3
 



PLAYBEE

ONE WINGED SLAYER

Member
Nov 8, 2017 4,703

 * Today at 2:24 AM

 * 
 * #91

Quadruple, but I don't like the phrase because I don't trust others to use it
properly.
 


OP
OP

CELS

Member
Oct 26, 2017 6,423

 * Today at 2:25 AM

 * 
 * #92

Here is Bryan Garner, in Garner's Modern English Usage ("more than" instead of
"larger than" but same idea):





Garner reaches the same conclusion as the NYT style manual: use a different
wording, because "three times more than" and "three times larger" are
susceptible to two different, incompatible meanings.

Here is a discussion from some math people:



THREE TIMES LARGER: IDIOM OR ERROR? – THE MATH DOCTORS


www.themathdoctors.org
The writer suggests that the interpreting "three times larger" to mean 3X the
original is the "idiomatic" understanding while interpreting it to mean 4X the
original is the "literal" understanding. Interestingly, Merriam Webster's
Dictionary of English Usage dismisses the "literal" meaning and says that there
is no problem at all with using "times more" or "times larger" because there is
no ambiguity.
 



ANOTHERNILS

Member
Oct 27, 2017 11,879

 * Today at 2:27 AM

 * 
 * #93

This is why math sucks
 



GFORGUAVA

Member
Oct 25, 2017 4,136

 * Today at 2:27 AM

 * 
 * #94

"50% larger" = original value + 50% = 150%
"3 times larger" = original value + 300% = 400%

"larger" means the percentage is added onto the base value.

The messiness is why that phrasing is bad.
 



THEHUNTER

ACTUALLY, THE BET IS STILL GOING

Member
Oct 25, 2017 24,532

 * Today at 2:28 AM

 * 
 * #95

This is exactly like the "how many holes does a straw have"

Stop trying to be edgy. No one says the phrase "one times as large". They say
double.

Like a normal functioning human should.
 



YYR

Member
Nov 14, 2017 3,097 White Plains, NY

 * Today at 2:30 AM

 * 
 * #96

This thread taught me never to say "three times larger than" again.
 



TONY B

Member
Dec 29, 2018 405

 * Today at 2:30 AM

 * 
 * #97

It's been addressed, but the sticking point is clearly the word larger. We can
ambigiously use it for comparison or growth:

Comparison: Thing A is three times larger than Thing B.
Growth: Thing A is three times larger than before.

The first one is clearly Thing A = 3 * Thing B.

The second on is ambiguous. Do we mean "Thing A is now three times the size when
compared to the size Thing A was originally" or do we mean: "Thing A has
increased in size by three times the size that Thing A was originally".

i.e. is it:

Thing A = Thing A * 3
Thing A = Thing A + (Thing A * 3)

And it's in this murky area that we now get the percentage crowd chiming in,
since percentages are typically expressed for growth in the second way. I'd
still lean to the thing being tripled personally, and would only go quadruple
once percentages are mingled, but I can at least understand how some might go
the other way, but to me, the average person to me wouldn't say "Thing A is one
time larger than before" if they mean it's now double its original size.

So in terms of the poll topic, because the only answers were:


 * Object B is TRIPLE the size of Object A
 * Object B is QUADRUPLE the size of Object A


Then I'd argue it was a comparison, meaning the correct answer is triple.
 
Last edited: Today at 2:54 AM



THEHUNTER

ACTUALLY, THE BET IS STILL GOING

Member
Oct 25, 2017 24,532

 * Today at 2:31 AM

 * 
 * #98

> bulletbill10 said:
> No, they'd probably say twice as large. But they could say 1x larger.
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

They could.

They might also save their toenail clippings and put pineapple on their pizza.
 



RIORIUS

Member
Oct 27, 2017 5,013

 * Today at 2:35 AM

 * 
 * #99

I get that logically it should mean quadruple, but if someone's saying this I
know they mean triple.

Language isn't based on logic, it's based on convention and usage. If you care
about being precise, don't use this sort of language, but if you hear someone
use it, know that they mean it the way that doesn't technically make sense.
 



NDED

Member
Nov 14, 2017 9,447

 * Today at 2:40 AM

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 * #100

> AnotherNils said:
> This is why math sucks
> Click to expand...
> Click to shrink...

This is actually why English sucks.
 


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