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MICHAEL VOGEL

heluecht@pirati.ca


MICHAEL VOGEL

heluecht@pirati.ca
Pirat aus Hamburg Mitte. Fahrrad-Freak, Social-Media-Junky,
Open-Source-Programmierer, Fan von islieb, Franzbrötchen und guter Schokolade.

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Hamburg, Germany
heluecht@pirati.ca
@heluecht:feneas.org
friendica

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2020-09-23 19:44:48 2020-09-18 19:48:09 2020-09-18 19:48:08 500273
 

MICHAEL VOGEL  

2 years ago •

MICHAEL VOGEL

2 YEARS AGO •



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

USING ACTIVITYPUB RELAY SERVERS


!Friendica Admins when you are running the current release candidate, you can
activate the ActivityPub relay functionality. It is working differently from the
"social relay" functionality.

The AP relays are always "firehose" relays. Means: You get all the content from
the relay, you cannot filter it. And the relay servers are some kind of island.
Means: The relays aren't interacting with each other and each relay has got
different content.

The first step is choosing a relay. This can be done via this page:
https://the-federation.info/activityrelay

Every relay has got a page where it lists all connected servers, see for example
here: https://ap-relay-ger.650thz.de/

So you can have a look if you are interested in content from them. For some
servers you have to apply to be able to add it.

If you want to add a relay server, please go in the command line and execute
bin/console relay to see all relay servers and bin/console relay add
https://relayserver.tld/actor to add one. The command will tell you if the
connection request had been successful.

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7 people like this

Steffen K9 🐰, Marc Hannebrook, MasterTux (Alter Account), Fabián Bonetti, Andy
H3, vinzv and Joseph Hogan like this.




Friendica Admins reshared this.

 

UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse •

@Michael Vogel maybe Friendica could just discard all posts that don't contain
the set tags?

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GEIR PETER  

2 years ago •

Are all the relay server standalone or do they interconnect?

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Michael Vogel it is a design flaw that is sold as a feature.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Michael Vogel I guess I would aktually prefer a better deletion setting, I
always have a feeling that the deletion is not working that well and the setting
is not easy enough to understand.
I can see receiving all the posts from relays is useful, but then the post have
to be deleted after short times. But then also the deletions would have to be
optimized I guess, if you have to delete many posts all the time, then you might
have to tune the cleanup jobs too.
But you know much better than I.

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration •

It would be good if the command would add all the nescessary details, that are
ont giving on the relay pages and that friendica needs .. so the pages are
showing servers without https:// and without actor .. you always have to know,
that you have to add it and to add "actor" on the end.

If something is changing, there have to be a grandmaster who tell you the secret
you have to add to the command, so that it is successfull. 🙁

So, if all infos pages are showing "domain.tld" the command should add
auotmatically "https://" and it should try also "/actor" at the end.

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

And additionally it would be nice if one could add a list of servers, instead of
just add one after the other.

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utzer ~Friendica~ likes this.




 

HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

pirati.ca
squeet.me

are no relay servers ;)

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@hoergen on Friendica @Michael Vogel yes for comma separated domains.

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration •

On those pages the actor URL isn't mentioned.
https://the-federation.info/activityrelay
https://ap-relay-ger.650thz.de/

The information is inconsistand, because on those pages you only have the
"domain.tld".

Entering that domain.tld with the console relay command will result in
domain.tld is no relay actor

With the command help information tells you



console relay - Manage ActivityPub relay configuration
Synopsis
        bin/console relay [-h|--help|-?] [-v]
        bin/console relay add <actor> [-h|--help|-?] [-v]
        bin/console relay remove <actoor> [-h|--help|-?] [-v]

Description
        bin/console relay
                Lists all active relay servers

        bin/console relay add <actor>
                Add a relay actor in the format https://relayserver.tld/actor

        bin/console relay remove <actor>
                Remove a relay actor in the format https://relayserver.tld/actor



You may get a clue, when you fiddle around it and just try different things like
adding https:// and/or /actor

I wouldn't use the "f" word, when an admin ave to test it with try & error to
find out how this works. Let's say, this is a draft feature (alpha version)
without error checks.

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration •

That is what I wrote ;)
You can work with the draft feature, but it is far from being flexible.. The
Admin has to be flexible, because the feature isn't ;)

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •

Playing around...
https://relay.libranet.de/
😀

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •

Seems to work well. 🎉

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •

Looks like one of the relays I peered has a lot of (news) bot content. I think I
have to look which one and disconnect it. It's too much.
This entry was edited (2 years ago)
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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •

relay.nazrin.moe is the relay with a lot of bot content. Unfollowed.
But if you like news bots from all over the world and if you like having one
post per second (a.k.a a firehose) you may chose that relay. 😜

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse •

@Steffen K9 🐰 can you collect you either collec experience or maintain you
relay well peered? I mean it is not necessary that this is done by every admin,
I am happy to help with feedback.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •

@utzer Pardon. I don't understand.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse •

@Steffen K9 🐰 sorry for the spelling mistakes. Can you collect the information
about the relays you suggest for a public server (yours) or even better manage
the relay peering accordingly, so not every admin had to do the work for their
own server. It feels kind of useless that everyone maintains a list of relays to
connect to.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

I went trough the list on the-federation.info an peered ...
https://ap-relay-ger.650thz.de/
https://relay.selfhosting.rocks/
with my own relay instance. These two are free to use, located in Germany and
seem to have a decent amount of content.
My Friendica nodes are only connected to my own relay.

I'd like to add a third relay as peer to my relay but I didn't find a good one
yet. I'm open to suggestions.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •


> And the relay servers are some kind of island. Means: The relays aren't
> interacting with each other and each relay has got different content.

@Michael Vogel There seems to be a peering and de-peering command to connect a
relay to another relay.


> You can perform a few management tasks such as peering or depeering other
> relays by invoking the relay.manage module

I'll try if that works...
This entry was edited (2 years ago)
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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •

Yep. Works...



List of 3 registered instances:
libranet.de
mordor.social
ap-relay-ger.650thz.de


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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Michael Vogel It will stay as long as I live. 😀

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Michael Vogel Haha. Yes.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Michael Vogel But seriously, I made it a systemd service now. It seems to be
very lightweight. So I will keep it as long as there is a demand/usecase for it.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 can you run it under relay.friendi.ca? That would be fun. 😜

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

That would be possible. But running a service under the official domain should
be a community decision.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 yes, usually that is decided by the need for the service, but I
see that we don't need to run the relay under that domain, so it would be just a
nice thing to have. How can the community decide about it in this case?

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de


> How can the community decide about it in this case?

I don't know tbh. The last time when I started running services under our domain
(forum node, xmpp support chat) it was more or less an "okay. do it." from
Michael and Tobias if I remember correctly. 😉

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 with the other post about the relay, I guess we can use
de.relay.friendi.ca, I just realized (again) that the Mastodon world is divided
by interest and language. Other than Friendica, which feels mostly mixed and you
just follow those users you're interested in.

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HYPOLITE PETOVAN  

2 years ago

I'd probably need to upgrade to a beefier VPS for that, I'm at a soft limit now,
my single-user node periodically hits the load limit.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

I guess we need to think about that first. 😀

How can the separation between "language" relays work?
Is it even possible to control what content is distributed via a relay?
Why do we chose German and English?
Should the relays be standalone relays or should they follow other relays too?
If so, what other relays should be connected?

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 let's just try it and see what happens. Let's do the de. and en.
and then let's see what happens.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

Also,...
What is the "right" amount of content?
How can we make sure small nodes are not drowning in the relay content?

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Michael Vogel yes or some better setting to keep posts for user ID 0 only a
short time. I still find it intriguing to have many posts, but then just keep
them shortly. The current settings are not so nice I think, maybe we can explain
them better or make them a bit easier to tweak.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Michael Vogel yes, I know there is a setting, I think I did set something
shorter.

But instead if the filter this would also be helpful. Maybe set a time of 2 days
for relayed posts, if there is many. Maybe keep thos with followed tags longer.
Mark the rest for deletion after reaching the limit, then purge them daily when
in one batch or so.

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

Hehehe I know, but there is always a downside. My servers blocklist ist still
growing from stoopid RSS bots that are using #Berlin hashtag like crazy for
everything. RSS Bots shouldnt be allowed to use hashtags.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@hoergen on Friendica hmm mine do. I think the tags are helpful, but it would be
good to be able to actually mark a #Bot as a bot and then be able to block based
on that info.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Michael Vogel So be it then. 😀

Please configure the following DNS records:


A       134.119.20.10       de.relay.friendi.ca.
AAAA    2a00:1158:3::141    de.relay.friendi.ca.



And while we are at it, let's make the forum node IPv6 ready:


AAAA    2a00:1158:3::141    forum.friendi.ca.


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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

There is something established for Bots , but I forgot how ou can use it.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 @Michael Vogel he could just set one A and AAAA and then CNAME.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

Ok. It is running. 🍾💃🎉 It's not possible to subscribe to it yet. I want to
decide about the policy first. Should it be open for everyone or should it work
with a postive/negative list or manual configuration of nodes?



HTTPS://DE.RELAY.FRIENDI.CA/


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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 not sure either... Open I guess, I wouldn't want to decide who
joins. How can people find it?

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FABIÁN BONETTI  

2 years ago •

Thank you
root@reisub-pc:/var/www/html/friendicarg.nsupdate.info# bin/console relay add
https://ap-relay-ger.650thz.de/actor
Successfully added https://ap-relay-ger.650thz.de/actor

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 can you open it for social.yl.ms and more importantly for
friendica.utzer.de, I will try it out.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

Well, well. I'm still puzzled about the separation between 'de.*' and 'en.*' and
what the idea behind that is and how that should be done. I'm also still unsure
about the scope of those 'official' Friendica relays. Are they "our" relays or
are they just some additional public relays for everyone?

And because everyone here seems to have no concept for these Friendica relays -
except from 'open it and add my server' - I will now make my own.

I'll not make it open for everyone. Because this would completely destroy the
vague idea behind the de.*/en.* separation. I'll work with a "whitelist" instead
to allow German based nodes only.
The page the-federation.info/friendica has a column for the location of the
server. That's the only country/language indicator I know of. So I will work
with that. German based nodes that are not on that list will have to manually
ask for approval.

Comments welcome. 😀

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 seems fine to me.
Regarding the de/en relay I am also not sure. I assumed there is servers that
have mainly German oder English content, but on the other hand I don't separate
at all, I use both languages depending on the topic.

I guess depending how it turns out we can still scratch the de prefix off an
just run one relay for whole of Friendica. Just having a relay.friendi.ca that
someone here controls is nice and also the domain is memorable, that was the
initial thought to ask for a friendi.ca domain.
This entry was edited (2 years ago)
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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

Thanks for your thoughts. The allow-list with 105 nodes 😉 is active now. I also
wrote some explanation on the web page of the relay.
You can add your nodes now. When something goes wrong please contact me.

We can still refine the policy later when we have a better idea how to configure
it.
This entry was edited (2 years ago)
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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Michael Vogel Keep calm. It takes some time until it appears on the page. Don't
know why.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Michael Vogel Maybe this happend due to the config change. I had this with my
own relay too. I have restarted the relay and the apache service. It seems to
appear immediately now.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse


> Thanks for your thoughts. The allow-list with 105 nodes 😉 is active now. I
> also wrote some explanation on the web page of the relay.

Just wonder why my server social.yl.ms is not shown on the-federation.info. Did
you or can you add it to the allowed list anyway?

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

it is listed as Mastodon. 😀
This entry was edited (2 years ago)
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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@utzer That's what I thought. 😀 Wait a minute...

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@utzer Done. Should work now.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 Danke!
Successfully added https://de.relay.friendi.ca/actor

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

Vermutlich braucht das auch noch Zeit, aber da ist was Setsames .. mein
Friendica Knoten horche.demkonti.nuum.de ist auf der Relay Seite
https://de.relay.friendi.ca/ gelistet, aber wenn ich versuche den Relay
https://de.relay.friendi.ca/actor hinzuzufügen, bekomme ich eine Fehlermeldung
"https://de.relay.friendi.ca/actor couldn't be added"

Auch erscheint der Relayserver nicht in meiner lokalen Liste, wenn ich sie mir
anzeigen lasse.

Mache ich da was falsch? Oder muss ich einfach nur warten?

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@hoergen on Friendica wenn Dein Server auf https://de.relay.friendi.ca
erscheint, dann ist das Relay hinzugefügt denke ich.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@hoergen on Friendica bin/console relay zeigt dir also kein Relay an?

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

Es zeigt mir andere Relays an, die ich hinzugefügt habe, aber nicht das
https://de.relay.friendi.ca/ .. das ich ja auch nicht hinzufügen kann.

Ich wunderte mich nur, weil mein Friendica Knoten trotzdem auf der
https://de.relay.friendi.ca/ Seite auftaucht.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@hoergen on Friendica Befehl ist bin/console relay add
https://de.relay.friendi.ca/actor, korrekt?

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

Genau, den gebe ich ein. Ich denke ich probiere es einfach später nochmal.
Vielleicht ist es wirklich nur das Timing.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@hoergen on Friendica Dann muss auf deiner Seite beim Folgen was schiefgegangen
sein. Der Relay hat deinen Server als Peer in der Liste.
Ich kann deinen Server entfernen. Dann kannst du es erneut versuchen - mit dem
Konsolenbefehl, den utzer gepostet hat.

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

Das wäre super, das würde ich gerne ausprobieren. Vielen Dank 🌻

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@hoergen on Friendica Das war seltsam. Mit 'unfollow' konnte ich deinen Knoten
nicht entfernen. Da kamen Fehlermeldungen. Ein 'force-remove' war dann
erfolgreich.

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

Oh, das ist in der Tat sehr merkwürdig. Ich probiere es gerade nochmal. Beim
ersten Versuch ging es schief und beim zweiten Versuch kam ein "successfull".
Danke dir für die Mühe 🌻

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 vielleicht kann @Michael Vogel schauen ob beim folgen eines
Relays, welchem man laut Relay bereits folgt, eine spezifische Fehlermeldung
kommt, die könnte dann entweder ausgegeben werden oder vielleicht einfach
ignoriert werden in der Art, dass das Relay bei Friendica einfach hinzugefügt
wird?

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Michael Vogel

> Also you could add the relais on https://the-federation.info/

Done. 😀



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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse •

@Michael Vogel is there a way to see if a post arrived via a relay? Is the small
globe the sign for relayed post?

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@utzer In develop there is a new icon with a mouseover tooltip "Relay" now.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 for a long time I was on develop all the time, but in the past I
learned you have to have time when something breaks. So I guess I have to wait
for that feature. Thanks.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@utzer Man kann ja mehrere Instanzen haben. 😉

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 joa kann man, meine Einzelinstanz war die auf dev, die
öffentliche auf master (jetzt stable). Hatte die Auto Updates mal deaktiviert,
aber vielleicht mache ich die wieder an, immer nach den backup.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de



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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Michael Vogel mouse over war schon der selling point schlecht hin, dass fehlt
mir sowieso schon länger wieder. Ich hab da zwar immer Symbole neben der Posting
Zeit, aber ich hab keine Ahnung was die bedeuten sollen. Das war mal anders.

Wie stabil ist denn die dev Version so in der letzten Zeit?

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FABIÁN BONETTI  

2 years ago •

is it normal so many requests? https://reisub.nsupdate.info/paste/paste.php?id=8

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MasterTux (Alter Account) likes this.




 

UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Michael Vogel

Zusatz: Die Symbole sind am PC und Handy noch da, aber am Handy gibt es keinen
Tooltip wenn man darauf tippt, sollte das nicht irgendwie machbar sein? Also
statt mouseover noch eine andere Funktion die die Beschreibung zeigt?

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Michael Vogel ja.

For reference: https://github.com/friendica/friendica/issues/9258
This entry was edited (2 years ago)
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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •

Hmm. I get a lot of "news" bot content now. Mostly mirrors of RSS feeds of TV
stations and other media sources. That makes the global community page somehow
annoying. I had to block around 50 news bot accounts to make it
usable/interesting again.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse •

@Steffen K9 🐰 yes, we probably have to implement some kind of bot marker in
Friendica too. @Michael Vogel and I are the ones to blame I guess.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse •

@Steffen K9 🐰 did you block them on your server or on the relay? On the relay
would not be my choice.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@utzer There is no way of blocking stuff at the relay. I blocked them on my
nodes.

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utzer ~Friendica~ likes this.




 

UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Steffen K9 🐰 good

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse •

@Michael Vogel as for the bot setting, is there some flag that bots can have in
Mastodon/AP?

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de •

@Michael Vogel Ok. I already saw your PRs. But Chinese/Asian stuff isn't a
problem at all. It's mostly German/English/Spanish content from news bots.
I do like the firehose most of the time. 😀 But maybe I should think about
switching to relay scope "hashtags". Thing is, in the AP world using hashtags
isn't that common.

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utzer ~Friendica~ likes this.




 

STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Adam Have you tried to manually register it on the-federation.info? That's what
I did.

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Adam Hmm. Worked here. After one minute or so the relay was listed.

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HOERGEN  

2 years ago from fediverseration

Not this one? https://git.pleroma.social/pleroma/relay/-/tree/master/
@Adam which code do you mean?

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STEFFEN K9 🐰  

2 years ago from libranet.de

@Adam Ah! Okay. I misunderstood that. 😀

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Adam if you can add AAAA don't forget to do so.

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UTZER ~FRIENDICA~  

2 years ago from Fediverse

@Adam alright.

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