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Results 1 to 12 of 12
THREAD: WHAT IS WEST SYSTEM'S 410 MICROLIGHT?
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1. 07-30-2007, 10:45 AM #1
Richard Smith
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Senior Member
Join Date Sep 2004 Location Wisconsin Posts 233
WHAT IS WEST SYSTEM'S 410 MICROLIGHT?
> Can anyone tell me what West System's 410 Microlight(TM) consistes of?
> The light tan colored stuff. Wood flour?
>
> "410 MicrolightTM is the ideal low-density filler for creating a light,
> easily-worked fairing compound especially suited for fairing large areas.
> Microlight mixes with greater ease than 407 Low-Density filler or
> microballoons and is approximately 30% easier to sand. It feathers to a
> fine edge and is also more economical for large fairing jobs. Not
> recommended under dark paint or other surfaces subject to high
> temperatures. Cures to a tan color."
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2. 07-30-2007, 10:56 AM #2
Dan McCosh
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Join Date Mar 2001 Location Grosse Pointe, Michigan, USA Posts 15,789
> Don't remember the technical name, but it is not wood. It is a
> thermoplastic that mixes with the epoxy as a filler. A friend in the
> composites business gave me 20 lbs. or so once--like a bag of feathers.
> The reason for the warning is that it has a lower melt point than even
> cured epoxy, so the filled material becomes soft in hot sunlight. I've
> used this to advantage, as it makes it flexible when in the sun and a
> joint moves a little, then hardens when it cools.
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3. 07-30-2007, 12:02 PM #3
JimConlin
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Join Date Oct 2000 Location Padanaram, MA USA Posts 10,284
> Originally Posted by Richard Smith
> ...It feathers to a fine edge and is also more economical for large
> fairing jobs. Not recommended under dark paint or other surfaces subject
> to high temperatures. Cures to a tan color."
> Funny, I've never seen the words Microlight and economical in the same
> sentence. It certainly is lovely stuff to work with, but the temperature
> sensitivity and very high cost have ruled it out for just about
> everything I do.
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4. 07-30-2007, 12:03 PM #4
few3
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Join Date Jul 2004 Location Deval Country Posts 398
> "Not recommended under dark paint or other surfaces subject to high
> temperatures. Cures to a tan color."
> I was told by West Systems, that Microlight once sanded, has microscopic
> air pockets that under a dark paint, "could" and "has" caused pin head
> sized dimples in dark paint. They cited one particular instance where
> Microlight was used on aluminum hulls IIRC. I was told ( double check
> with West, to make sure ), that after sanding the Microlight, one or two
> coats of "neat" epoxy will prevent the problem by filling in the pores.
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5. 07-30-2007, 12:23 PM #5
Figment
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Join Date Dec 2001 Location Connecticut, of the newer England. Posts 12,956
> Now that some of the premixed putties have been refined (awl-fair,
> quick-fair, etc) I don't really see a need to use microlight anymore. Of
> course, I'm not counting every ounce of weight in my work.
> "Visionary" is he who in every egg sees a carbonara.
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6. 07-30-2007, 12:25 PM #6
ssor
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> I seem to recall that it is phenolic micro ballons.
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7. 07-30-2007, 02:07 PM #7
Todd Bradshaw
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Sailmaker
Join Date Jun 2000 Location Madison Wisconsin Posts 10,657
> It's a microballoon-based mixture with some other stuff added. The
> problem with getting a decent paint job happens with any microballoon mix
> or with straight microballoon fills. When you initially sand it smooth,
> you cut open some of the balloons on the surface, exposing their hollow
> insides. These are too small for paint to flow into and fill, so it traps
> air inside. Stick it in the sun, let it heat up and the trapped air
> expands and may pop a little hole in the paint. Even without the
> potential heat problem, painting over voids and expecting the paint to
> seamlessly bridge the gaps, even small ones, isn't a formula for a good,
> smooth paint job.
>
> Sand your microballoon fills fair, give them a coat or two of plain
> resin, sand it smooth (shouldn't take much) and then paint. The resin
> won't flow into the cracked balloons either, but it's strong enough and
> thick enough to resist blow-outs and provides a truly smooth, void-free
> painting surface.
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8. 07-30-2007, 02:20 PM #8
Todd Bradshaw
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Sailmaker
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> One more thought: If you mix up a bowl-full of 410, it only takes a
> couple shots of resin and a whole bunch of 410, assuming you want a
> mixture that won't sag before it hardens. I havent tried to measure it,
> but I wouldn't be surprised if the entire finished and faired fill
> expanded enough at high temps to stand slightly proud of the surface and
> no longer be fair until it cooled down again - even after being resin
> coated because the temperature is going to soften the resin as well.
> Perhaps that contributes to the warning about dark colors. The fills are
> light enough that there is obviously an awful lot of air trapped in
> there.
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9. 08-01-2007, 09:09 PM #9
Richard Smith
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Join Date Sep 2004 Location Wisconsin Posts 233
> Thanks everyone.
>
> So . . . is the mixture or its component(s) (other than microballons)
> available from a "generic" source?
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10. 08-01-2007, 09:16 PM #10
Thorne
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Like my hat?
Join Date Aug 2005 Location SF Bay Area- Richmond Posts 16,421
> As far as I know these are only available through West Systems -- you
> could possibly buy similar materials and roll yer own, but who knows what
> you'd end up with, and you'd need enough to do the whole boat ( with some
> left over for any repairs) to maintain consistency.
> "The enemies of reason have a certain blind look."
> Doctor Jacquin to Lieutenant D'Hubert, in Ridley Scott's first major film
> _The Duellists_.
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11. 08-02-2007, 06:49 AM #11
Dave Carnell
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Join Date May 2000 Location Wilmington, NC, USA Posts 638
MICROLIGHT IS PLASTIC
> The reason it is not good under dark paint is that it melts. Glass
> microbeads as made by 3M are far better and cheaper.
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12. 08-04-2007, 08:59 PM #12
few3
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Join Date Jul 2004 Location Deval Country Posts 398
MICROLIGHT IS NOT PLASTIC, EPOXY IS
> Microlight ( from it's MSDS ) contains
>
> -Sodium Borosilicate (Technically called HGM or Hollow Glass
> Microspheres)
>
> -Formaldehyde Polymer with Toluene < 7% ( Technically called "stuff", and
> it makes up less than 7 % of the filler )
>
> -Isobutane < 5% (I have no idea how the gas is in the filler, unless it
> off-gasses, but who cares, it makes up less than 5 % of the filler )
>
> -Tris (dimethylaminomethyl) phenol <3% ( Technically called "other stuff"
> but less than 3 % is in the filler)
>
> -Vinylidene Chloride < 0.3% ( Technically called "polymer stuff" but less
> than 0.3% is in the filler )
>
> I could be wrong here, but it seems to me that Microlight is 84.7% holow
> glass microspheres ( HGM), and not plastic.
> Last edited by few3; 08-04-2007 at 09:07 PM.
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