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SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | PODCAST

Shining a light on what really goes on backstage at some of the world’s top
startups and companies.

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Sales Enablement Innovation
“Involve yourself and raise your hand”, Christian Palmer
28:54
“Involve yourself and raise your hand”, Christian Palmer
28:54

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Featured“Involve yourself and raise your hand”, Christian Palmer

Christian Palmer, Sales Enabler at Riskified, developed a passion for learning
in school, before eventually making his way into sales training and subsequently
enablement.

28 Min


“SOLO ENABLEMENT CAN EASILY SLIDE INTO ‘WOULDN’T IT BE NICE IF…’”, DAVE SWEENEY

Dave Sweeney, Enablement Partner at Solutions Driven, leading the organization’s
enablement function on his own for almost two years.


EPISODES

28 Min


“INVOLVE YOURSELF AND RAISE YOUR HAND”, CHRISTIAN PALMER

Christian Palmer, Sales Enabler at Riskified, developed a passion for learning
in school, before eventually making his way into sales training and subsequently
enablement.

27 Min


"IT ALLOWS ME TO BE MORE ENGAGED IN THE CONVERSATION", ADAM KUCERA

Adam Kucera is Sales Director at Uniphore - whose Conversational Automation
Platform can deliver the most sophisticated, accurate, personalized, and
automated customer experiences on the planet. No frustration, just true
understanding – including emotion and intent in real-time.

26 Min


“NO, BUT…” AND WHY THAT MATTERS IN ENABLEMENT, STEPHANIE WHITE

Stephanie White is Senior Director, Revenue Enablement at Loopio, one of our
Ones to Watch in 2023, and a familiar face to those in the enablement community.

25 Min


“YOUR CLIENTS AREN’T ALWAYS US-CENTRIC AND YOU DON’T WANT TO ALIENATE THEM”,
KEITH BROOKS

Keith Brooks is CEO at B2B Whisperer. Keith is a no-nonsense, upfront, and
honest international executive with a solid technical and financial background,
specializing in marketing B2B technical solutions that increase revenue and meet
business goals.

28 Min


"WHATEVER THE BUSINESS NEEDS, WE DO IT", TJEERD VENINGA

Tjeerd Veining is currently GTM and Sales Enablement Director at EnterpriseDB,
and is a long-time sales enablement professional with extensive experience at
Microsoft, as well as at MessageBird and Optimizely.

26 Min


"SALES ENABLEMENT IS THE COMPETITIVE ADVANTAGE FOR REVENUE TEAMS", TIM HARRIS,
UNIPHORE

Tim Harris is Director of Product Marketing at Uniphore.

18 Min


“DON’T FORGET THAT SALES IS ABOUT PEOPLE”, WITH MARIE BRUNET, UNIPHORE

Marie Brunet is Global VP of Sales at Uniphore - Uniphore are evolving
conversations with the trifecta of voice AI, computer vision, and tonal emotion.

25 Min


“SHARING SUCCESS AND FAILURES WITH OTHERS TO SHORTEN THEIR LEARNING TIME”, WITH
MICHAEL WALKER, DYNATRACE

Michael Walker is Enablement Manager at Dynatrace - combining deep
observability, AIOps, and application security in one open, unified platform to
continuously deliver precise answers and intelligent automation from data.

24 Min


“LISTEN TO WHAT THE REP ISN’T SAYING TOO”, WITH GAIL BEHUN, JUNIPER SQUARE

Gail Behun is Senior Director of Revenue Enablement at Juniper Square - which is
empowering GPs and LPs to unlock the full potential of investment partnerships.
Juniper Square envisions a world with radically expanded opportunities for
investment and participation in all private markets.

24 Min


“UNDERSTANDING HOW ADULTS LEARN IS KEY”, WITH CARLA PRICE, LIFTOFF

Carla Price is Team Lead, Revenue Enablement at Liftoff - a one stop shop to
programmatic user acquisition and re-engagement. Liftoff helps find all of the
best users for your app, deliver the most engaging ad experience, and optimize
towards your user LTV goals.

22 Min


“THEIR WIN IS ALSO YOUR WIN”, WITH CAITLIN PANOPIO, ZSCALER

Caitlin Panopio is a Revenue Communications Intern at Zscaler, a global
cybersecurity organization. As a student at UC Davis, she studied communications
and tech management and that was the perfect springboard for a budding career in
enablement.

25 Min


“TRUST YOUR GUT AND DON’T SECOND GUESS YOURSELF”, WITH KIERAN SMITH, ANDELA

Kieran Smith is Senior Manager, Revenue Enablement at Andela - a global job
placement network for software developers which focuses on sustainable careers,
connecting technologists with long-term engagements.

25 Min


“EVERYBODY’S CONTRIBUTION IS IMPORTANT”, WITH OYSTER’S CELINE GREY

Celine Grey is Director of Revenue Acceleration at Oyster, a global employment
company that builds a bridge between companies and the world’s top talent.

22 Min


“TO BE EFFECTIVE, A SALES TEAM HAS TO LEVERAGE SALES TOOLS CONFIDENTLY”, WITH
TIGERLRM’S DOROTHY MICHEL

Dorothy Michel is Director of Operations at TigerLRM, a next-gen sales
enablement solution and CRM. Dorothy has a strong history in sales enablement
and through TigerLRM is committed to making sales enablement easier and more
efficient for organizations everywhere.

22 Min


“SALES ENABLEMENT, IN SIMPLISTIC TERMS, IS ALL ABOUT EFFICIENCY”, WITH EXCLUSIVE
NETWORKS’ MARK LEFF

Mark Leff is the Director of Services Sales in North America at Exclusive
Networks. With a rich history in sales enablement prior to his current role,
including positions at Cisco, Mark has wide knowledge and strong views on how to
create effective, efficient enablement programs.

27 Min


“BE BOLD AND BE A STRONG VOICE”, WITH THOMAS INTERNATIONAL'S STEPHEN PEGLER

Stephen Pegler is Head of Sales Enablement at Thomas International. Prior to
“stumbling” into enablement, he had a learning and development background before
moving to the United States to help kickstart a sales training program.

25 Min


“DIVERSE TEAMS OUTPERFORM THE COMPETITION”, WITH ETQ’S MELANIE WALTER

Melanie Walter is Director of Enablement and Learning at ETQ. She kick-started
her career by selling to some of the biggest companies in the world, before
discovering her true passion was in the sales training and coaching world.

25 Min


“WE’RE THE ONES THAT KEEP THINGS MOVING FORWARD”, WITH HOPIN’S NIKKI SCHANZER

Nikki Schanzer is the Head of Sales and GTM Enablement at Hopin. She recently
spoke at the Sales Enablement Summit in Austin during our return to Texas!

28 Min


“DRIVE DATA ON HOW ENABLEMENT IMPACTS THE BUSINESS”, WITH MELIO’S PETEK HAWKINS

Petek Hawkins is Melio’s Head of Enablement, and one of SEC’s Ones to watch for
2022! She is dedicated to building global enablement strategies and departments
that enable organizational revenue growth.

25 Min


"BE VOCAL ABOUT WHAT YOU NEED", WITH MARIADB'S DEL NAKHI

Del Nakhi is MariaDB's Director of Global Revenue Enablement. Driven by a desire
to help people and make an impact, her learning and development (L&D) background
led her to revenue enablement, where her focus now lies on supporting people
across the organization

28 Min


"FOLLOW YOUR CURIOSITY", WITH ZSCALER'S WHITNEY PERRY

Whitney Perry is Zscaler's Strategic Communications Specialist, and part of the
Revenue Enablement and Velocity team there. Her role is a unique one, as not too
many enablement teams have their own dedicated communications manager.

21 Min


"I'M GEARED TOWARDS BUILDING THE MACHINE FROM SCRATCH", WITH FORTER'S MICHAEL
GUGLIOTTI

Michael Gugliotti is the Global Head of Sales Enablement at Forter. He's built
his career from the ground up, starting in a call center. From there, he
progressed further and further up the ladder, and is now making his mark by
building Forter's enablement department.

34 Min


"GO GLOBAL, AND THINK LOCAL" WITH KORBYT'S NICHOLAS GREGORY

Nicholas Gregory is VP for Global Sales Enablement at Korbyt. He has a wealth of
experience in sales enablement, working across North and Latin America, and
EMEA.

19 Min


"THE KEY TO OUR SUCCESS IS BUY-IN FROM LEADERSHIP" WITH RACKSPACE'S JOE CARDENAS

‘It's all about presence, and it's all about confidence. I was able to see that
firsthand’, says Joe Cardenas, Global Program Manager – Onboarding, at
Rackspace.

33 Min


“IT’S ABOUT MAKING THINGS SIMPLE”, WITH SHIFT'S KEVIN RICH

"I see a coach as a coach, whether you're in sports or in the business world"
says Kevin Rich, ex-hockey coach and now Head of Enablement at Shift Technology.

22 Min


“SALES ENABLEMENT REQUIRES A BIT OF SOUL-SEARCHING”, WITH GOOGLE'S CAMILA BORDA

“It’s been an absolute wild ride”, says Camila Borda, Head of Sales Development
and Strategy at Google, about her sales and enablement career journey.

24 Min


PEOPLE BUY BECAUSE THEY LIKE YOU, WITH GOOGLE’S THEO DAVIES

People buy because they trust you and because they like the product - in that
order. This is why it’s so important for sellers to develop the skills to see
things from a customer's perspective, says Theo Davies, Head of Sales Enablement
JAPAC at Google Cloud.

22 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | SPENSER MILLER-FELLOWS, INVICTI

From call center worker, to coach & trainer, to channel enabler - and now
heading up the sales enablement team at Invicti, Spenser says his current role
is the best he’s ever had.

14 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | JACLYN D'ARCY, GHX

Engaging customers virtually has been a challenge for many organizations over
the past year, and Jaclyn D'Arcy, Director of Revenue Enablement at SaaS
healthcare company GHX, tells us how she's been focused on hybrid relationship
building with both internal and external customers.

21 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | LEORE SPIRA, SYTE

“Sales operations is just one piece of the puzzle; revenue ops gives you the
full picture.” Syte’s Head of Revenue Operations, Leore Spira, sees
organizations shifting their focus from just the traditional ‘sales’ function,
to recognize every customer-facing role as a generator of revenue. And that
means enablement needs to support every team that influences the customer
journey, from pre-sales, to retention and renewal. In this Sales Enablement
Innovation podcast, she talks to us about this, how the pandemic has provided an
opportunity for rev ops to shine - and how she almost became a lawyer and a
marketer before arriving at her current role.

20 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | CARLY LEHNER, ANDELA

Five years ago, if you’d asked Andela's Head of Revenue Enablement, Carly
Lehner, what her ideal job would be, she’d have said one that involves training,
strategy and working with sales and process design. And, lo and behold, that is
that is pretty much what enablement is. So she absolutely loves it. Carly talked
to me about why planning and executing sales kickoffs (SKOs) is where she’s in
her element, being prepared to share her opinion (even if it goes against the
consensus), and how revenue enablement is the next natural step in the evolution
of sales enablement.

24 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | BRANDON JONES, PAAY

Developing your leadership skills isn't just about what they teach you in
business school. Brandon Jones' top tip is to immerse yourself in biographies of
effective leaders (think George Washington, Steve Jobs and Winston Churchill) to
dig into how they've motivated their teams and navigated their way to success.
As VP of Revenue at PAAY, success means breaking down barriers between sales,
marketing, account management and customer success to create a smooth customer
journey. Find out how he goes about taking full-funnel responsibility - and why
it's so important for him to replicate those organic, 'water-cooler'
conversations at the start of Zoom calls.

18 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | KUNAL PANDYA, USERZOOM

As Director of Global Sales Enablement at UserZoom, Kunal is responsible for the
enablement of the global revenue team, including a full spectrum of roles: SDRs,
account executives, account managers, and strategic account executives. He
talked to us about maintaining a culture of engagement and collaboration, how
onboarding himself created a roadmap for onboarding new hires, and his
commitment to unlocking the potential in every individual to be the best that
they can possibly be.

22 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | GEORGIA WATSON, IBM

Sales enablement can mean so many different things to different people. For
IBM's sales enablement specialist, Georgia Watson, it boils down to helping
sellers to be their best in the market, so they can deliver value to their
clients. In this episode of Sales Enablement Innovation, she talks to us about
how the pandemic has created a blank canvas for innovation, and how you need to
have the right culture to bring those ideas to fruition aligned with core
business strategy. Find out what sales enablement looks like at IBM - and steal
some of Georgia's tips.

23 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | BILL PETERSEN, LITMUS

How do you get the most value from your content? For Litmus’ Head of Sales
Enablement, Bill Peterson, it’s all about creating consistent, evergreen
learning content that's kept fresh with regular product and competitor updates.
He’s shifted to weekly, just-in-time learning paths that everyone can plan ahead
for, which has improved completion rates and allows sales reps and leaders to
make suggestions about what they’d like to be included in future sessions. Learn
more about this and Bill’s take on all things enablement (including his DJ sets
at Litmus’ latest SKO event).

23 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | GAIL BEHUN, PANDADOC

For PandaDoc's Senior Manager of Sales Enablement, Gail Behun, high performance
sales enablement means working in tandem with marketing (who craft the message)
and product (who provide the detail). Aligning objectives and expectations is
key - 'level-setting', as Gail puts it. She's also passionate about helping
sellers to grow, and develop their career paths - for her, enablement goes
beyond reps simply hitting quota and excelling in the short-term. In this Sales
Enablement Innovation podcast, Gail shares her philosophy for nurturing
sustainable success, and how she encourages all enablers - and aspiring enablers
- to reach out to others in the community to forge connections, share knowledge
and immerse themselves in the discussions happening online.

31 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | CHRISTI WALL, CHAINALYSIS

Is the enablement function shifting to encompass every team member who steps
into the buyer cycle? Christi Wall, Revenue Director at Chainalysis, certainly
thinks so. Another big change, now we're online-only, means a greater focus on
developing intangible interpersonal skills like empathy, building trust, active
listening, and how to read a virtual room. In this episode, Christi also
navigates us through her career trajectory, sharing how she’s flipped her
opportunities during the pandemic, as well as giving us her take on making
training fun (hint: it involves a lobster costume).

19 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | HANG BLACK, JUNIPER NETWORKS

“There are a lot of ways to scale a mountain. Some people have a jet to take
them up, some people have a helicopter. Some people have access to tools that
you may not have. But we need to recognize when people are throwing down ropes
for us.” Hang Black, VP of Revenue Enablement at Juniper Networks, discusses how
women and immigrants can break into the leadership ranks by sharing her own
journey: learning to identify limiting beliefs and behaviors, getting used to
operating in chaos, her strategies for excelling under adversity - and why being
‘busy and bored’ during Covid gave her the impetus to write a book that had been
in her head for 15 years.

18 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | STEFFANEY ZOHRABYHAN, SPRINKLR

With so many tools in our tech stacks, most of us know the feeling of having 101
tabs open at the same time. Can sales enablement really make sales processes
seamless and friction-free for their reps through digital adoption? Steffaney
Zohrabyhan, Digital Adoption Leader at Sprinklr, thinks so and talks us through
how she does it, why you can't feed your reps a whole elephant at once - and how
the philosophy of Clippy the ‘helpful’ Microsoft paperclip lives on.

30 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | RACHEL HA'O, ITERABLE

Everybody has their own superpower, says Rachel Ha'o, Global Sales Enablement at
Iterable, and your job as a sales enabler is to help execs discover and amplify
it - not simply copy what’s worked for yourself in the past. In this podcast,
Rachel talks about how she moved into sales enablement by ‘moonlighting’, the
importance of humility as a sales enabler - and shares her number one early
morning tip for keeping on top of priorities in a pandemic.

31 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | CLAIRE SCULL, VERITAS TECHNOLOGIES

Can the principle of 'less is more' be applied to sales enablement? According to
Claire Scull, Director of EMEA Sales Enablement at Veritas Technologies, it's
the tenet to live by as enablement moves forward in the new normal. Her view:
offer more to sellers by focusing on the critical few elements that are relevant
and crucial for their success. In our final episode of 2020, Claire shares how
she's kept her sellers' wellbeing front of mind in a remote environment, her
success in bringing fun and gamification into an inaugural virtual SKO, and how
no two days are ever the same on the job.

31 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | JAREN KRCHNAVI, SIEMENS

Got a sales training programme? Check. Sales reps have a high course completion
rate? Check. Job done, right? Not quite - and Jaren Krchnavi, Head of Sales
Enablement for Siemens Digital Grid Software, is here to tell you why. Moving
away from the 'checkbox' mentality and towards a business-oriented performance
measuring system can be tricky, but the payoff is substantial. From
understanding customer needs and pain points to deploying a global non-technical
training programme, Jaren shares the unique trappings of leading enablement
within one of the largest industrial conglomerates in the world.

37 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | DANNY DE LOS SANTOS, ATLASSIAN

How do you build and maintain engagement, excitement, and a sense of community
for your sellers when it's impossible to be in a room together? Danny De Los
Santos, Curriculum , Strategy and Training Team Manager at Atlassian, may have
the answer: podcasting. Diving into the daily realities of supporting the sales
team at an organization that is continuously growing and scaling, Danny shares
some of the programmes he's recently developed to keep reps educated and
entertained.

27 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | ADRIANA ROMERO

How many of us have come to appreciate the importance of flexibility and
adaptability in recent months? For Adriana Romero, being able to think on her
feet and problem solve on the fly comes as second nature. In this episode of
Sales Enablement Innovation, Adriana shares her leadership journey and how she's
come to embrace the startup mindset - as well as how to navigate cultural
differences and turn them into strengths.

37 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | THOMAS CHERIYAN, OWNBACKUP

What is it like leading sales enablement at a hyper-growth company spread across
several continents? Tom Cheriyan, who heads up the function at OwnBackup, is
somewhat of an expert - he’s successfully de-siloed function-specific knowledge
and expertise with a centralized LMS and established processes to streamline
onboarding and training, from account executives all the way to sales
leadership. His ultimate goal? To have 100% of his sales force hit their
targets.

36 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | TANYA JEFFERS-MCALLISTER, RBC INSURANCE

You may not need a psychology degree to succeed in sales enablement - but
according to Tanya Jeffers-McAllister, Director of Sales Practice Effectiveness
at RBC Insurance, it can certainly help! Navigating stakeholders’ key priorities
and juggling different personality types are all in a day’s work, and driving
cultural change - while overseeing the integration of two different companies -
takes a certain skillset and some creative thinking.

28 Min


SALES ENABLEMENT INNOVATION | AARON EVANS, GLOBALDATA

Building a sales enablement structure from the ground up at a global
organization is no mean feat. Aaron Evans, Director of Sales Enablement at
GlobalData, is well-versed in the ups and downs of this marathon; from being the
central link between leadership and the rest of the business and getting buy-in
from internal stakeholders to achieving company-wide cultural change, he’s ready
to share what he’s learned along the way.


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 * Sales Enablement Innovation | Podcast

“Trust your gut and don’t second guess yourself”, with Kieran Smith,
AndelaAugust 26, 2022
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Kieran Smith is Senior Manager, Revenue Enablement at Andela - a global job
placement network for software developers which focuses on sustainable careers,
connecting technologists with long-term engagements.

Kieran has a long history in sales and sales leadership positions, and has since
dived into Andela’s revenue enablement team.

In this episode, we discussed the transition into enablement from sales
leadership, and much more.




 * NOTES


 * TRANSCRIPT

   

NOTES


KEY TALKING POINTS:

 * Why Kieran made the jump into enablement from sales leadership, and why he
   finds coaching rewarding. 
 * What enablement looks like at Andela, and how Kieran splits his time between
   various activities. 
 * How Kieran envisions the future of enablement at Andela, and what his ideal
   setup looks like.
 * Kieran’s thoughts on the “golden” ratio of 1 enablement team member to 50
   reps.
 * Getting buy-in from reps who are used to thinking enablement is a
   “punishment” for bad performance, and eliminating that stigma. 

And much more!

TRANSCRIPT

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for Tiger alarm and close more deals today on the show today is Kieran Smith. He
is senior manager for revenue enablement at anda. Karen, thank you so much for
taking the time. We appreciate it. Michael, Thanks. Thanks for having me on. I'm
looking forward to the chat. Awesome So to kick things off, could you run
through your sort of background, your experience and how you've gotten to this
point of entering the sales enablement revenue enablement world? Yeah, of
course. I suppose I thought I had an unusual path into an event, but I think
it's actually quite common in that my background is from a sales professional
sales leader. And then I pivoted across. So to add a bit more to that has been
in sales for about 16 or 17 years initially as a sales person as we all start
out. And then probably the last 10 years was in sales leadership. How I got into
enablement was I've been a director of sales and a head of sales at a couple of
one big company. And one start up. And the second one, I was made redundant
during the pandemic as a lot of people were, and at that point, I took a little
bit of a step back and was a bit more self reflective because I hadn't really
enjoyed the last two roles and sales leadership. So thankfully I've got a very
supportive wife and she said, well, why don't just jump straight into another
direct sales job? Why don't you have a bit of a think about what it is that you
actually want to do? So I did that and actually my boss has been on the podcast
before Carly. I knew her through something called the revenue collective and
actually picked her brain at the time and said, I know that you do sales revenue
enablement. Giovanna, if I pick your brain on that a little bit and. And see
what that is. I think she'd mentioned before about potentially that being a
career path. So I had a bit of a chat with her, went out, did a few interviews
as, as, you know, sales or revenue enablement can have quite a broad definition.
So I went out and spoke to a few different people over a few different things.
And then probably about two months later, the job actually came up at andela,
where Carly was. And I reached out to her and said, look, we are primarily a US
based company. And I reached out and said, would you consider anyone from me?
She said, yeah, I'll put your if you apply, I'll put you through the process
like anybody else. And that role was to focus on support and ease and enterprise
ease. So what we did when I came into andela, that's what my initial role was.
So it was a bit of a strange pivot, but it was just more the reason it brought
me into revenue enablement was more around what I actually enjoyed in terms of
doing the tasks every single day. So yeah, that's what brought me to Andela
about 11 months ago. That's quite the journey, to be fair, like especially with
the pandemic and things like that. I guess what would be how have you found the
transition in terms of enjoyment? What is it that I guess you enjoy more about
doing the sort of enablement side of things? Well, interestingly, as I say, when
I did that self-reflective piece, I looked at what I was doing on a daily basis
and the bits that I was drawn to was around the culture and the strategy, sales
process, methodology, stuff like that. So that's all the things that we can
uncover and most enablement jobs. So that's when I dived into enablement in a
little bit more depth. That's what kept coming up and tells a bit of a pattern.
And I think another huge part of that. I really enjoyed was the coaching side
and obviously, depending on which company that would be dependent on, the amount
of coaching you do is an enablement team, but certainly here at umbrella I and
we do quite a lot as a team. So that's, that's the bit that I've really enjoyed.
And just in terms of that, that pivot across and it's good to be doing a very
similar job entails we still get involved in strategy, albeit from a slightly
further away viewpoint, but we still get involved in all those things. But it
just allows me to be a lot closer to the reps without having to worry
necessarily about just getting to the number. And I can actually focus on the
enablement and making sure that they're productive and effective. All right.
Absolutely and I guess one of the things you sort of mentioned there about
Andela being a little bit closer to the reps and things like that, how does sort
of the setup for enablement look like there? Like in terms of how much of your
time is split between coaching and strategy and these different sort of things?
We actually just about to be in a period of transition as a team. So when I
first joined, we had a team of three, we had my team is 4 was four people. So we
had someone and we were role based support for enablement. So what we had is one
person focused on skills, myself, who was focused on ease and enterprise ease.
And then we have my colleague Bailey who's focused on post-sales. So we call
them client partners, which since they're code managers and then we have an
onboarding program manager. But what's happened is over the last year, we've
matured really quickly as an enablement team, and we're actually moving away
from the role based support and know what we were looking at is maybe more of a
top of funnel, bottom of funnel sort of approach. So where initially the
corporate side of things was, was relatively easy to sort out in terms of
because we had someone based at the time purely based on skills. So you could
look at the overall training needs and the knowledge gaps and stuff like that.
But then if there was time to coach you to the managers or support the managers
around the coaching of the team or the specific reps who wanted or needed
coaching or support, or even just someone to talk to sometimes about maybe
something not clicking or not working. We it's actually quite easy right now.
We've had someone just move on from the team, so we felt a bit more stretched in
a moment. But yeah, I would say that probably me personally, I would say that
80% of my overall time goes on coaching of reps or catching up with reps to see
if they need anything. So the coaching culture is something I massively believe
in and I'm really passionate about. So it's something that we're trying to dive
even deeper into as a revenue business unit. Right and one thing I want to touch
on as well is since you're sort of relatively new, I guess, to the specifically
the enablement side of things coming from that sort of director head of sales
role, what was sort of one of the biggest challenges in switching over or walk
out your surprise maybe in making that switch? Do you know what the biggest
thing was? Is, is the gray area of where enablement starts and stops and where
the manager side of things as a director of sales or that my previous roles I'd
never really with maybe one company I'd want to as a training department and
that was very much just training rather than enablement and it was sort of
content stuff came from marketing or reports came from revenue operations. So it
was all very siloed where I was before. So me coming in to the enablement side
and I was really lucky that I worked with a fantastic senior leadership team and
they accepted me in and got me involved in all these strategic conversations
around building, building playbooks, defining the strategy, defining the
processes. So initially I found, as I said, when, when and where does my role
start on my involvement even start and stop on certain things, like even with
coaching, you've got to make sure that everyone's singing from the same hymn
sheet. You don't want to be giving advice, which is different from managers or
different from directors or VP of that business unit. So it's that would be the
biggest thing I would say. And it was I think I probably second guessed myself a
lot. And that maybe sometimes said too much on certain things, sometimes maybe
didn't see enough or push enough. But I would say for me that was the most
difficult part to get a real handle on. Right right. And you touched on silos
there as well. And I guess thinking about we hear it a lot, especially at our
events in terms of how dangerous that can be. How do you manage those
interactions at in terms of making sure you're not siloed, interacting with
other functions and things like that? Yeah, we are. We're really lucky. Tell
that we're really collaborative in a number of different ways. So like my boss
colleague, so revenue enablement and revenue operations both reporting to her
and across us, we, we work really, really well together. We've got fantastic
revenue operations team and we kind of work hand in glove with them. You know,
we, we help define the processes along with them and they do the backend work on
Salesforce reports or whatever that may be. And we enable the reps on how to use
it. Should be what. Really, really. Well, same with marketing, where we are now.
So in the last recent sort of probably quarter or two, we've really started
working a lot more with marketing around content, around team specific cadences,
but we're now being a lot more data driven. So rather than lots of reps writing
their own cadences, we want to get to the point where we have specific cadences
that are driven by data around we know what subject lines, what the best, what's
called CTAs calls to action, what the best. So we're working really
collaboratively with marketing. So our team meetings, for example, are all
RevOps and rev enablement together. So we hear about each other's progresses,
problems, blockers that we can tend to help each other out. So we worked really
well together and we're actually really as I say, we're really fortunate that
Andela in general is a really collaborative place to work. But certainly within
the revenue team, everybody knows where to go to ask for things and things you
seem to get done at a really high pace, but also the quality of the work is
really high as well. So we're quite lucky that we've managed to foster that,
that, that, that's definitely good. I think we hear a lot of horror stories as
well, whereas it's always nice to avoid that. I guess sort of going forward,
what would you sort of see as in the future of the revenue team there and
revenue enabled team? Like what direction do you want to take it in? And I guess
sort of also bouncing off that is what does your ideal enablement team look
like? I guess you're always striving for that ideal. So it's a similar, similar
question. Yeah I think as I mentioned, we are going through a bit of a
transitional period at the moment. I think more working towards top of funnel,
middle of funnel, bottom of funnel. And I think even our on or onboarding
program manager, everyone's role in the last year has seemed to have really
broadened across what we're responsible for. I like to give an example. When I
first come in, I was working really only with A's and enterprise enterprises,
and then I was promoted to the senior manager on the team. So I was overseeing
the team, had to know what was going on with still kpis, then started working
with the senior leadership team, started working with the directors. Then we
created a new team. So on the programs front, we have leadership development
program, we have something we call Epic academy, which is for skills to help
with a career path mapping for them, which is a fantastic program as well, and
we'll go to run that again. So everyone's roles really broadened to where we are
at the moment. We've kind of grow there organically, which is great that we've
got to that point. I think ideally we'd probably just wrap a little bit more
structured around that, and I think for us to take our own team to the next
level, I think I've got one person that I need to bring in to help with the
chopper funnel side of things. So I think we'll focus on that. I'd like to see
overall just. That sort of process, but then we just broaden it out. So I think
we'd like to get to start for a little bit more micro learning in terms of
putting some structure around that to work, almost like an on demand type
situation where rather than enablement facilitating that, we have to be
certifications or on demand learning paths that people can do, even if it's
about specific parts of the sales process. Like maybe it's objection handling.
So rather than having to do a live session or a coaching session, that is like a
path where we explain out through videos, through whatever sort of medium. So I
think ideally I'd like to get there. And then as I mentioned before, the biggest
thing I would like to add to make more robust is the coaching culture, but as
across not just for us to reps but from VP level and CIO level to their
managers, their managers to their reps, understanding what real coaching is. And
for me, there's no better return on investment and time spent than coaching your
reps. Right lots of businesses do hire more people to try and get more revenue
on the board where that's probably the most costly way of doing it. And it also
takes the longest amount of time to ramp people up. Whereas if we could get
someone from a 50% productivity to 80% productivity, then probably a shorter
period of time, then even from there get more moving. They need two on the
bottom line revenue straight away. So that's for me. We've invested a lot of
time using things like go and working with the managers, we're using scorecards,
stuff like that, and it's helping us because we get a lot of data on the back
end of where you know, which set of reps to focus on who's doing best practice,
how do we extrapolate that best practice around? So again, just really diving
deeper into that. So I think if we could get the microlearning. More robust
programs around things like the equity Academy and the leadership development
program and then the coaching culture. I think we'd be in a really good
position. That's really interesting and clearly a lot of big steps being taken
there, which is really exciting. One thing I did sort of want to touch on a
little bit, you mentioned sort of bringing people on and that sort of thing. How
do you see, I guess, the ideal sort of how many reps to enablement sort of we
sometimes hear about 1 to 50 is the golden ratio. Do you have a sort of, in your
experience, a number that sticks out to you? No, I've been to I went to the
sales enablement summit last year in London, and I went to another event earlier
this year. And we seem to be we seem to be in a really fortunate position our
enablement person to retina but isn't actually to high and I know how busy I am
so I can't imagine how basically these people that have hundreds reps to one
person. I've heard some other horror stories of people have 200 reps to, to one
enablement person, let's say, even if it's like a region like EMEA or somewhere
else. I think, you know. I would say me personally, if you really want to be
able to enable more than just churning out content that people have to or
programs that people have to kind of do by themselves, the fact that you can
actually enable and speak to people and understand. I would definitely say. For
me. Less than 40. Right 40 to 1%, obviously. Anywhere between 25 and 50 is
probably the dream spot. But I think even if you're getting to 50, you imagine
ten, 20% of them are probably pretty self reliant. They can go on. But then
you've got probably a larger portion who need some help for whatever reason, and
then you've got that middle portion that's going to be pushed up as well. And
that takes up an awful lot of time. Even if you only meet with those people for
30 minutes every couple of weeks or even every month, and then you've got to
facilitate all the other out and meet with the managers. It just I think
probably it just becomes too much too soon as you start getting over 50 reps.
All right. And it's definitely difficult to get that personal touch as well. I
imagine one of the things as well. I want to touch on is that you've been in the
role for a little bit, sort of looking back, if you could give yourself a bit of
advice. Going in. You could go back and say, right, I'm about to jump into
enablement. Now, with that knowledge, what would be your piece of advice that
you give yourself? That's a good question. You know, I don't know that I would.
For me personally, it would be just trust your gut. Right don't second guess
yourself, because that's what I was doing initially. But outside of that, I
think. Yeah, I think I wouldn't change my approach and how I commend. The first
thing I did very similar to being in a leadership role was speak to everybody. I
spoke to every rep within the past two weeks that I was going to be supporting
and got their feedback on. How often do you use enablement? What do you use
enablement? Have you ever worked with enablement before? What should opinion on
it? Because I came in with a fresh pair of eyes, so I just ask them to be as
honest, and that would be an approach that I would encourage people to take. And
I was looked at, I think, just based on my experience of being a sales leader,
that's what I would do if I took a sales leadership role. So I came in and did
the same thing and it was really eye opening because you got to see who was sort
of bought and who wasn't, what were the trends, what was anyone complaining
about things. And you've just got to be able to pick out what's just a niggle
and what's a real problem and where do you focus your time. So I actually
wouldn't change too much about my approach. The only thing would be stop, second
guess and just ask questions. If you're unsure about what you're responsible
for, just ask everyone know and also maybe push back. Because sometimes I've
talked to some leaders and they want lots of things done, but they want you to
do them right when it's a 5050, it is a partnership rather than or I need this
done, can you create it? Can you do it and then deliver it? And I say, well, no,
not really. That's not really my job. So I think probably understanding again
that gray area of where my role starts, where it stops. But yeah, that would be
really that. That's interesting. One of the things you mentioned there was about
speaking to everyone and seeing who would buy in. And if people were even using
enablement, did you sort of get any voices that were saying they weren't using
enablement at all or didn't find it useful? And I guess, how did you approach
that if that was the case? Well, interestingly, I joined an exciting time of
Andela. So my boss, Carly and the existing enablement people who are really,
really focused on our SAP segment, because that was the area that needed the
most love when Carly was coming as the head of enablement. So they'd focus
massively on that. So when I came in and started speaking to enterprises, they
were like, well, we haven't really had much exposure other than a couple of
programs or certifications. So it was a mixture of what should I enablement
here? What's your opinion of enablement in general or training in general?
Because a lot of people will equate enablement to training. And I suppose the
biggest one of the biggest stigmas was. Like working within the government isn't
a punishment, right? We're here to scaffold, here to help. So and that also
comes from the managers where, oh, you're not performing. Go and work with
enablement. So that that's a bit of a negative connotation of working with us.
So I think there was that and say, Oh no, I've never I've never been on a plan
or a pitch. I've never had to work for enablement. It's like, well, that's not
really what we're here for. So there was a settled within certain people's
mindsets. There was a little bit of a shift required. But yeah, that was always
going to have people that are put in a spot. And I think, yeah, the SMB segment,
they're fantastic. But again. They had had a lot of attention. So where the
enterprise hadn't, it that was a bit more of an enterprise. Things move a lot
slower as well in terms of the sales cycle and stuff. So in order to be able to
see the results, it's a little bit like waiting for an oil tanker to move. So it
was getting some quick wins and stuff like that. But yeah, I'd say the biggest
thing was getting over that stigma that we're not some sort of punishment to
work with us. That's really interesting. I hadn't sort of, I guess, considered
that angle of it. I'm sort of keep an eye on the time. I did want to ask you,
you said moving forward, you guys are looking at things like microlearning and
those things enablement as a whole. You've kind of jumped into it quite an
exciting time as it's, you know, expanding rapidly and gaining a lot more
recognition. How do you see, I guess, enablement as a landscape overall
progressing? Do you see maybe use of ai? These are things that we're seeing on
the horizon. What stands out to you? Yeah well I think enablement I think some a
fairly couple of people say it, but I think throughout things like the pandemic
and stuff like that, I think we've seen enablement really come to the fore in
terms of justifying itself, rather be the cost center and become a really
effective part of the revenue team or the revenue org and be able to help
support and Coach and tell the tools. We've got quite a lot of tools at andela,
so it wouldn't surprise me if we were starting to see some AI regards like
trackers and things on Gombe and we've got a really good one that we use at the
moment and come up with economic pulse tells of things that hired in free stuff
like that and layoffs, all these as well. So we're already getting things like
that coming up. We've got a couple of tools that we work with marketing around,
helping us with engagement schools and stuff like that, and a lot of that's AI
driven. So it wouldn't surprise me at all if we started to see a lot more of
that, I think. Beyond Dota two and beyond that, I think what we're more likely
to see as a shift in sales processes. So a lot of people talk about being
customer centric or buyer centric, and I think that shift is still being made.
Whether you use challenger or space or gap selling, I would still say that these
are in the minority in terms of people using them. And I think. Especially we'll
talk at the times right now where people talk about recession and stuff that
lots of layoffs, not a lot or not an awful lot of good news in the market. If
you're not providing value to your prospects or your customers, you're not going
to be around for long. So I think we're going to see even more people lean into
that, how we pull out that information usually which tools are that I maybe
that's where that comes in. But I think. We're going to have to be a lot more
focused on onboarding clients to ever building on that overall customer
experience or customer journey, which people have been talking about four or
five years. But I think we're still there's probably still a lot of work to be
done in October in the sales world in general. And I think that's where I can
see enablement really helping to shift that. That makes a lot of sense. How
important then is, I guess, having a revenue enablement function that looks at
sort of the full funnel versus just sales enablement where you kind of go to
that full customer experience, you know, even post-sale. I think it's vital. And
I think that's where, as I say, certainly in the more recent months, we've
looked at working a lot more in depth with marketing for a number of different
reasons for content like blogs and stuff like that salespeople can use to catch
by prospects or existing customers' attention all the way through to the
cadences that we're talking about that we're able to scaffold. We're working to
help create revenue, regardless of where that comes from. So to give you an
example, I worked with a chap in marketing called David Dolnick and his team,
and we look at a specific practice that we work on select day. I work with them,
we'll look at the data personas and they'll create a cadence along with the data
practice lead. So we'll look at how to capture people's attention. So they work
on the set of subject lines, quota actions, the content or who the c-suite is
going to. Director and then on the other side of that, what I'll do with the
same practice leaders, I work with the reps. We'll look at what's the best
questions to ask this type of persona. How what problems do they have? What,
where can we add value, stuff like that? And so we'll scaffold in both sides of
that. So it just means that the reps have a much deeper understanding when they
go out to go after this. And if marketing just gave you an email template with
sort of back it up with the questions and the support around that and group
sessions, then we would never really going to know if it's going to work or reps
are not going to feel prepared to go out there. So I think whether that be with
marketing, whether that be with rave UPS or a different thing, I think that's
you've got to work in that collaborative way and work right across the revenue
because they all affect the bottom line ultimately at the end of the day. But
that is I really appreciate that insight that was really in depth. I think we're
probably just up to time. So I just want to say thank you so much for coming on
to the show. I learned a lot. I hope so. People listening did as well because I
found that really interesting. So Thanks so much for taking the time. Wonderful
Thanks a lot. Thanks for tuning in. Be sure to check out our other episodes and
go the sales enablement collective dotcom for even more sales enablement
content. You can also join our global community. On Slack and you can find the
link to that on the SEC website. See you next time.



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